Cineversity

Dear Dr. Sassi,
I hope I spelled it right this time sorry about last time. I wanted to ask you and anyone who would probably know. I built a quick model of a cell phone (school project) for which i have to combine procedural shaders and BodyPaint. So i modeled my phone.. created a few shaders with color and bump channels. I go to Body paint to further edit my model. But I need to use the Photoshop PP projection method in which i have to freeze my layer, export it to Photoshop and then bring it back to BodyPaint. I understand the process, i tested it on simple shapes and it works for me, but #1 : I was hoping to paint on the color channel in Photoshop, but when i run the set up wizard and recalculate,  I do not check my color channel otherwise I would loose my color information i created on my shaders (bumps and noises). Is there a way to get around this without loosing the previous work on my color channel. I need to do this for a final project in which somehow i need to use the photoshop body paint integration. I can create a diffusion channel and send it to photoshop, but i could only do black and white edit. Do u know if there is any other way to get around this. Now if i create a new color channel, i will be able to paint but i believe my previous work would go black and white ... I hope i’m not confusing u. :(
jorge ramos

Also, I have watched your tutorials and some other ones, and I’m a bit confused. Since I have 3 previously created shaders, what’s the best way to go around this when running the wizard? So far I’ve been practicing with SELECTING OBJECTS, but when my teacher did the demo for my piece he select materials, IT SEEMED kind of simple when i have one shader on the phone but now that i started to use more than one shader it gets a little tricky.  can u please guide me on how to go around this?
Thanks again!
Jorge Ramos

Hey Jorge Ramos,

How about exploring the Layers in BodyPaint.

What I do not get is that you re-calculate the Object with the Wizard. To recalculate for example the UV information again and again might destroy soon or later your work—must not, but I would not suggest to use the wizard too often. You can do all of that manually, the Wizard is a start, not a must do. To say it clearly, any work is doable ignoring the Wizard completely. But if you feel good with it use it. I prefer to use the manual way most of the time. You can create textures right in the channel itself! (Create new Texture, instead of loading one, this option is available where ever you can open a material to supply a shader or texture. Save them!

Think of BodyPaint 3D as a multi channel Photoshop, Will say, for each channel, you have a Layer-system available. You will find all these layers in a similar way as in Photoshop.

Keep in mind that Photoshop is not always needed, there are quite some tools in BodyPaint 3D and you can even paint in 2d with it. Yes, both packages have some advantages and it is tempting to move between both, but try to stay as long as possible in BP3D, to save time (it might cost you some time on the start, but sometimes BD3D is able to do what you might need)

All the best

Sassi

The question is, do you have something in Photoshop, a plug in for example, that you need? If you use mostly Photoshop options, you might can get that in BodyPaint3D.

To your second post:

I mentioned it, but the Wizard is not a “Must Do” procedure! If you learn how to work without it you might feel more comfortable.  It is an option to get an initial set up, or maybe do some stuff that is simpler to do like a “batch”, but again not at all the one and only.

I can understand that if you try to change things, the “actions” of the Wizard might work against you intuition or leave you with a feeling, is it really doing what I want? It is an offer, nothing more.

If you’re good with Photoshop, use that knowledge to get the layer options in BodyPaint 3D as quick as possible under your control. Blend-modes, layer masks etc all is available. The Freeze mode is nice, but it takes some time, again check what you can do in BD3D already.

Yes, you need to be organized, which means, name your material wisely, Mat, Mat1, Mat2, etc will lead you into chaos, similar to that name the textures (which were not included in your scene!), a good naming convention is key for professional work. Normally is has this structure “proj_artist_scene_part_tex_0001” something like that, other wise you have to memorize each name and after 3 month you have no idea what “testfinalalternative.exr” means. It starts with small scenes, and if not used to get into your muscle memory, in large team work projects it won’t work then. From the start. You wrote it becomes more tricky, wait for a project with 1,000 parts, and even more textures.

I hope that helps a little bit.

Thanks Dr Sassi,
Sorry if some of what I said doesn’t make sense, but i’m new to C4D :(  ...Well the point of the me going to photoshop was just to prove during my final exam that i know the process of sending my textures to photoshop to do whatever edit i could possibly do. Yes I’m aware that pretty much everything can be done in bodyPaint without having to go to photoshop, but my instructor wanted me to demonstrate that I know how to do it. So I thought of doing some color edits on my texture in Photoshop, but my issue is that I have previously created a shader with a color channel and a bump. So I must do the set up wizard at least once in order to start painting right? maybe i’m mistaken and if i am wrong please correct me. Also, you mentioned LAYERS YEs it’s fun to use layers and very powerful but as u saw on my file..i don’t think can add a layer to my color channel… because i would need to create a new color channel in the wizard and that would delete any previous information i have created on my shaders…So the color channel would look gray out for me in the materials windows in order to safe my previous work on the shaders.  Is that correct? Am i confusing you :( ? sorry if i am.  So i guess for the purpose of this exam I will explore the body paint photoshop integration in the diffusion channel :( this is a must do for my final ..
Also is there any tutorials on here on how to lay UVs. At least one that teaches the principles and how to go about laying UVs depending on the objects. I find that having the UVS layout is very helpful and speed up the process when working on body paint. I understand the principles but I would like to learn more about UVS when to use different projections, and so on.
Many thanks in advance for your replies and I hope I’m not boring you with my questions. I’m sorry but I’m a NEWBIE and just learning
Jorge Ramos

There is no need to use the Diffuse as alternative channel, as you normally should use it for the Diffuse part of your work, do not put that into the Color Channels, it will slow you down when you have a change. I know many people don’t use it and I really don’t get it. To split information means to gain control.

Try this, prepare the size of the texture that you like in Ps. then load the Shader in your channel into a Layer Shader. You can add then the texture, and stick with one material. All in e.g. the Color Channel. This texture can then have in BP3D Layer (Image layer) on it is own, inside of the Layer Shader.

All of that if you like to stick or need one Material only.

More ...tomorrow, its 11:30pm here. :o)

Hey Jorge have you tried this combination I mentioned last night? Yes, that is nothing that the Wizard could set up. If you need to combine textures and shaders, that would be my suggestion to do. As an alternative, you could bake the results of the shaders and use them like textures. In a BodyPaint3D/Photoshop driven workflow, that might make sense. (Normally Shaders have a huge advantage against pixel based information, as they (if well coded) they are resolution indented. Textures have certainly limitations.

UV. WEll, each project has its own rules and needs. The “Rule” of Thumb” is here to take a color grid (like a checkerboard in changing colors) and use this first as texture. In this way you can check if one of the standard targets with textures is given. A standard could be the most evenly distribution of texture pixels compared to the object surface. The color square of such a texture allows to “see” that in an easy way.  There the layout of an UV solution can be optimized.

Mostly in use is the concept to peel the surface like an orange, by creating large parts of the orange together. Not too large to avoid distortions based on the convex vs flat translation. This is mostly done automatically with the Relax UV option in BP3D (UV Edit).

Projections are following the “typically” need for an object, like an Orange would be cover best with spherical projection, someone might need even there a different one. You can select polygons and change the projection for those and then “Generate UVW Coordinates” for those, to get a nice mixture of projections all stored in UV.

If nothing helps, manila work is need. Which might produce the best results, but is very labor intensive.

Besides that - there are highly specialist applications available to support your work there, but they are not cheap, but if heavily used worth the money.

On the end- as with most parts in 3D the artist is requested to be creative, which means s/he needs to know the tools, to develop unique solutions. If that sounds sloppy - then keep in mind that you can simulate to a certain degree the whole world and well The Space as well with 3D. There is not a one solution fits all, or as some like to have it - a plug in that makes go away all problems.

All the best

Sassi