A new version of Cineversity has been launched. This legacy site and its tutorials will remain accessible for a limited transition period

Visit the New Cineversity
   
 
Grey scale as a bump?
Posted: 11 December 2012 03:51 PM   [ Ignore ]  
Total Posts:  43
Joined  2009-06-03

Hi. Anyone have a suggestion on how to go about this?
I have to create a ‘pin impression’ still image.
the pins are a bunch of capsules that I’ve created and I need to push out some to form a face in the filed of pins.
Thought perhaps there was a way to do this by using the greyscale in the face photo…?
Any help is greatly appreciated! Image attached
Brian

Profile
 
 
Posted: 11 December 2012 06:26 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]  
Administrator
Avatar
Total Posts:  365
Joined  2006-05-17

Hi Brian,
First off, are you using broadcast or studio?
What you want here is a combination of a cloner object set in conjunction with a shader effector.

Now the difficulty here is that the greyscale image doesn’t actually show depth.
ie. the area of the nose in shadow…this would not be affected by the shader effector because black == no effect.
So this means the cheeks would be raised, but the dark part of the nose would fall back.

If this is just a still, it wouldn’t be too hard to paint the “depth” which would really be painting out those shadows so they are brighter…and maybe darkening the edges of the face so they are not so raised.

If the face must be animated, then another solution will be needed.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 11 December 2012 07:02 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]  
Administrator
Avatar
Total Posts:  12043
Joined  2011-03-04

Hey Brian,

Yesterdays approach or the DIY way:

The effect that you want is doable with a very low intensive light, so it creates darker values for a larger distance. This technique was in question after Nine-Inch_nails used it in a video clip.

A friend of mine at that time used just the screen-light of his laptop and the camera as well of it. Note that this needs perhaps make up, to avoid glossy/shiny areas (which would peak then). In photoshop you might “clean up” that area a little bit and set the levels.

As Patrick mentioned, shadows are not really helpful either, so the light should be close to the camera lens. If I had to do it for a larger production I would fog the room (film-gear-stuff) as you would normally use very find stable fog to “paint the light inside the room (or just to show the depth of it)

=======

Today—I would do it differently since we have a lot of new tools for 3D-stereo conversation. Have a look at the Pixelfarm PFDepth
http://www.thepixelfarm.co.uk/product.php?productId=PFDepth
is the way to go for anything professional if you ask me ;o)


The Effect, as long as based on a good depth map (Z-Depth) is very simple to create, A cloner and a Shader Effector. If you like the pins in a hexagon like structure—check out one of my MoGraph tutorials, which I did with this in mind. It is simple.

All the best

Sassi

 Signature 

Dr. Sassi V. Sassmannshausen Ph.D.
Cinema 4D Mentor since 2004
Maxon Master Trainer, VES, DCS

Photography For C4D Artists: 200 Free Tutorials.
https://www.youtube.com/user/DrSassiLA/playlists

NEW:

NEW: Cineversity [CV4]

Profile
 
 
Posted: 11 December 2012 07:50 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]  
Total Posts:  43
Joined  2009-06-03

Thanks Guys!
This is just a still so not as involved as you describe. I’d love to delve into a motion thingy - but just a still now.
I do have the full blown Studio C4D.

I understand that my photo is flat and that grey gradations are the key. That I can fix.

I need to learn more about the shader and cloner effectors to do this it seems.

I’ll look into the tutorials as you mention Sassi. I’m not familiar at all on how to use a 2d grey image to create depth in 3D.

Brian

Profile
 
 
Posted: 11 December 2012 08:06 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]  
Administrator
Avatar
Total Posts:  12043
Joined  2011-03-04

Hi Brian,

Think of the gray values like a measurement. From the camera to a certain point in space the values express close to distance OR from black to white. Like you have for an 8bit/c image the values 0-255 for a channel.

The gray map/texture is a translation from distances. like zero meter would be black and 100 meter would be white, then a middle gray should be given between zero and 100 meter. (If used in a gamma free image…but that is perhaps not important while starting to explain that technique).

Important is to understand that “we” use here images to store and use values. In terms of your image, the space is perhaps only a few centimeters or some inches. To get the most out of the gray map, you need to “normalize” this. Which means nothing else that the ears would be a dark gray, the cheeks a middle gray, and the tip of the nose a bright grey. These Values can be then used to move the clones (in the nail board the nails) back and fore.

The Shader Effector can take from a texture these values and based on the parameters you set into it the nails move accordingly. Please understand the Shader effector only as an option to get a single pixel value for each object, it does not work as a shader for a single clone (a common misconception)

You picture might work to the degree that the nails are moving—somehow—but there is no option to get from this image anything that would resemble the result that you would get in reality, pushing your face into this kind of object.

Does it makes more sense now? Let me know.


All the best

Sassi

This is how your image should look like to get the effect:

 Signature 

Dr. Sassi V. Sassmannshausen Ph.D.
Cinema 4D Mentor since 2004
Maxon Master Trainer, VES, DCS

Photography For C4D Artists: 200 Free Tutorials.
https://www.youtube.com/user/DrSassiLA/playlists

NEW:

NEW: Cineversity [CV4]

Profile
 
 
Posted: 11 December 2012 08:52 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]  
Administrator
Avatar
Total Posts:  12043
Joined  2011-03-04

Here a quick example from that face, just a sketch:

 Signature 

Dr. Sassi V. Sassmannshausen Ph.D.
Cinema 4D Mentor since 2004
Maxon Master Trainer, VES, DCS

Photography For C4D Artists: 200 Free Tutorials.
https://www.youtube.com/user/DrSassiLA/playlists

NEW:

NEW: Cineversity [CV4]

Profile
 
 
Posted: 11 December 2012 08:58 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]  
Total Posts:  43
Joined  2009-06-03

Thanks so much Sassi,
That image is exactly what I need. I can really use any persons face.
The one thing that I can’t grasp is how to affect a whole bunch of these ‘pins’ as a whole..?
I made the field of them as rows of instances… I guess I need to create the field as individual pieces, but still how to affect them as a whole?

Brian

Profile
 
 
Posted: 11 December 2012 09:21 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]  
Administrator
Avatar
Total Posts:  12043
Joined  2011-03-04

Hey Brian,

Here is the simplest file I can think of to create the effect. Check out the Gradient-Shader and how the Shader Effector uses it.

The Depth-Face was produced with an object from the library, just rendered a depth map (let me know if there is a question.

All the best

Sassi

File Attachments
CV2_r14_drs_12_MGys_01.c4d.zip  (File Size: 82KB - Downloads: 179)
 Signature 

Dr. Sassi V. Sassmannshausen Ph.D.
Cinema 4D Mentor since 2004
Maxon Master Trainer, VES, DCS

Photography For C4D Artists: 200 Free Tutorials.
https://www.youtube.com/user/DrSassiLA/playlists

NEW:

NEW: Cineversity [CV4]

Profile
 
 
Posted: 11 December 2012 09:27 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]  
Total Posts:  43
Joined  2009-06-03

Geez, you’re a life saver!
So I’m thinking I could group my pins together under a null and treat that null the way you treated the cube in this scene file you sent?

Profile
 
 
Posted: 11 December 2012 11:09 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]  
Administrator
Avatar
Total Posts:  12043
Joined  2011-03-04

Brian,

I have no idea what pins are under this Null. If it is a single one, I guess so (I have to guess as I don’t know your set up. You might just replace it and see what happens.

Or attach the file here in the thread.

All the best

Sassi

Attachment - Depth Face Image.

File Attachments
depth_Depth-face_large.zip  (File Size: 182KB - Downloads: 186)
 Signature 

Dr. Sassi V. Sassmannshausen Ph.D.
Cinema 4D Mentor since 2004
Maxon Master Trainer, VES, DCS

Photography For C4D Artists: 200 Free Tutorials.
https://www.youtube.com/user/DrSassiLA/playlists

NEW:

NEW: Cineversity [CV4]

Profile
 
 
Posted: 11 December 2012 11:55 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]  
Total Posts:  43
Joined  2009-06-03

Working great! The possibilities!

Profile
 
 
Posted: 12 December 2012 03:50 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]  
Administrator
Avatar
Total Posts:  12043
Joined  2011-03-04

Nice! Yes there is a lot of options in these object! Enjoy!

 Signature 

Dr. Sassi V. Sassmannshausen Ph.D.
Cinema 4D Mentor since 2004
Maxon Master Trainer, VES, DCS

Photography For C4D Artists: 200 Free Tutorials.
https://www.youtube.com/user/DrSassiLA/playlists

NEW:

NEW: Cineversity [CV4]

Profile