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Boston Terrier Illustration: Using BodyPaint 3D to Create a Custom Hair Map
Posted: 10 April 2021 06:11 PM   [ Ignore ]  
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Hello

I have got hopelessly lost/confused in UV BP Paint. The video makes no reference to enabling paint using the wizard - which I’ve done but I now find there’s areas on the mesh that just refuse to accept paint. I’ve made a quick screencapture to demo. https://www.dropbox.com/s/q53owy3ofi6oyfw/uv body paint.mp4?dl=0

I’m really struggling to follow along with this as so much just doesn’t seem to work. I’m even struggling to describe what I’m confused about because I’m baffled by pretty much all of it. The UI is incredibly confusing and there’s multiple instances of colours etc. I don’t understand why I’m not seeing what I have painted on my UV. I get stuck in the UV unwrap in BP edit and can only get back to the model by changing layout to standard and then back to UV. It’s a pretty endless list of questions to be honest

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Posted: 10 April 2021 07:42 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]  
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Hi charlesbatho,

Thanks for your efforts with the screen capture, but it doesn’t show me what I need to see.

Yes, there is no mentioning of the Wizard, as it might destroy all the work done so far. The Wizard is a starting point when you like to start with an object, and nothing else was set up. If just use as is, all the UV work done so far might be lost.

In short, the UV is the bridge between a 2D image and the 3D mesh. Each polygon of the mesh has a UV polygon to transfer the image’s information to the model. The brushstroke on the model uses the UV to place the new information into the texture. The exception here, as shown in the tutorial, is the Projection mode. The projection model is a virtual layer that allows for painting the information to a 2D layer in space. The moment you move the camera and confirm the projection, it will be translated from the virtual plane to the texture.

To see what settings you have and give you feedback on that, I need your file to provide you with feedback about the problem. Pretty much 95% of the time, the project file is the leading way to solve a problem. (Save Project with assets …)

All the best

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Posted: 10 April 2021 08:22 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]  
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P.S.: here are some pointers based on the file that one can download below the tutorial. I have deleted all “stuff” that is not relevant for this.

https://www.amazon.com/clouddrive/share/7d7KedvsBr4lg6OfjhU3tjgFMdSJXWP74ZHRpcqASiY

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Dr. Sassi V. Sassmannshausen Ph.D.
Cinema 4D Mentor since 2004
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Photography For C4D Artists: 200 Free Tutorials.
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Posted: 10 April 2021 11:05 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]  
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[edit: I can’t get the dropbox png links to display] zip of 3 pngs here https://www.dropbox.com/s/hft8lm1x7l7pbp5/png.zip?dl=0

Thank you so much. I’m really blown away by the help available from you here.

One of the reasons I got into such a mess was by undoing things and finding some elements persisted even though I had deleted them. What I’ve done is undo and go through things methodically making a list of questions/problems as they’ve arisen.
Here is my c4d file https://www.dropbox.com/s/qnb2a70t70sr7gf/gravymesh_0001.c4d?dl=0

From the top

What do these 2 button icons do/indicate - esp the one on the left. The right indicates the colour but why do you need to turn it off/on? what-are-these-material-icon-buttons.png?dl=0


I create a new material ‘blend’ and I have to create a texture for the colour so it can be mapped to the UV. I see I can right click to save the texture but it seems to save without me doing this. Where is this new texture saved and why does it seem to persist even if I delete the material and create a new one?

I apply my material to the dog object. I double click on the UV tag to open it as a popup and I see the UV without the texture. If I click on the uv tag now I see the UV with the texture. If I click the UV tag in UV edit I see the UV map with the texture applied. Why is it set up this way - it’s really confusing to me.

Why does the paint brush become blocked when painting on the model even though I’m in the same unwrapped UV. I can paint on the UV directly and it’s transferred to the model. Screen capture https://www.dropbox.com/s/s5tnzv7kckco8e8/capture1-paint-blocked-on-model.mp4?dl=0

I could undo but how would I simply fill this bg layer with a solid black colour as you would in Photoshop?

I add a new layer in the layers tab layers-with-new-layer.png?dl=0 but if I switch back to the materials tab this new layer isn’t reflected in this view materials-without-new-layer.png?dl=0 Why?

Now I select a white colour in the colours tab but can’t paint at all on the model with my brush using 3d or projection painting. Screen capture https://www.dropbox.com/s/osuj1i8sfg92vfa/capture2-can’t-use-brush.mp4?dl=0 Why doesn’t this work?

I’m sorry for so many questions. I hope you can see my confusion and I’ve explained things clearly. I had a whole other set of issues with the UV unwrapping but this can wait. My unwrapping seems uneven even though I feel I followed the process of the video but it not my primary concern

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Posted: 10 April 2021 11:22 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]  
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what-are-these-material-icon-buttons.png?dl=0

Tried the link in a separate post and now can’t delete it!

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Posted: 11 April 2021 01:14 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]  
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Thanks, charlesbatho. You’re very welcome.

I have made another little screen capture, as we talk about icons and the effect of it. I assume it is easier to get and hopefully quicker than to put it in words (The manual might be better for that)
https://www.amazon.com/clouddrive/share/iiUlhv9tNGZMFdPYxacvofa1L2gq15IrYqWdyEI9hzK
There is a download option, the viewing improves when offline.

The Save the Texture is in the BodyPaint 3D menu: File> Save Texture. Until it is not saved, it “lives” in the memory. Save often and again.

The direct paint (vs. the projected paint) depends on the UV for size. If the UV is not in the same size for all parts of the model, the brush will change its size. Like the texture pixels, if the UV is not done properly, the “resolution of the object’s surface will vary.

To fill the whole layer, use the bucket (left side, click and hold the mouse over the Gradient icon).

When you can paint in projection mode but not in direct paint, check all the icons presented in the screen-capture.

I’m sure you get used to these things, as they help to manage where to paint. If they are not muscle-memory, they might prevent painting at all. Yes, that is annoying, and I guess we all have gone through that. But in no time you get used to it, you paint only where you want to paint. You can paint reflection and color, for example, at the same time, but if you don’t want, then you check the little pencils.

Enjoy your weekend

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Posted: 11 April 2021 06:39 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]  
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I thank you again for this reply and your screen capture. I understand the icons more now. I’ve spent ALL day with this going over the same stuff again and again and it’s just not working consistently or at all like your video.

I’ve used the bucket to fill the layer however
a) I can’t click the foreground and background colour chips and make them switch position as in your video. It just switches to the colour tab. I have managed to paint with foreground and background colour using right click drag
b) the bucket doesn’t fill predictably. It’s turned to 100% tolerance but I have to click randomly 5-6 times before I see the blue circle and the paint bucket works. Screen capture here https://www.dropbox.com/s/qchtz3nc3qw7vg8/capture1.mp4?dl=0


The really big thing is… *I still can’t replicate the painting you demo in your video despite the icons being set correctly* and you don’t suggest what else might be the cause

My first thought was it must be my badly unwrapped UV mesh that was preventing the painting.
So…
I removed the hair and unwrapped UV to just the base model with a fresh UV tag using a standard projection mapping.
I deleted and recreated the blend material and texture.

Unfortunately I still see the no entry icon trying to paint certain parts of the model despite having all the icon states matching yours and regardless of whether I’m in 3d paint or projection paint mode. Rotating around the model makes no difference. The only thing that does seem to change things is be massively enlarging my brush size I find I can trick Cinema into allowing me to flood paint parts of the model where a small brush is blocked. Screen capture here https://www.dropbox.com/s/aibsf4crsh2zv0v/capture2.mp4?dl=0

Please can you give me some better idea of what I am doing wrong. Is it the UV projection, is it a hidden selection? What’s blocking me? It’s driving me mad

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Posted: 11 April 2021 07:12 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]  
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Hi charlesbatho,

Please provide your file. As usual, screen captures do not allow for a lot of information.

It looks like frontal projection instead of UV, as the paint strokes create long lines. With a project file, I could say it with certainty.

The background foreground color switch will work ONLY in the lower-left corner of the icon. It is a very tiny area. If you click on the colors, you get to the color setting.

If you simplify, you gain more focus on a problem but do it in a completely new project file. To do it where you encounter an issue is less effective.

If you get stuck somewhere, call up a new file, use a sphere and explore it on that simple object. The key here is not the sphere: It is the new file.

Have only a single material and a single texture in it. The idea is here to limit the parts and allow for a more straightforward exploration. Typically, after something is not working, all kinds of things are tried in a file, which gets only worse in some cases. With a new file, you start fresh. When this is done and easy to reproduce, it often clears the view to solve the more complex scene.

All the best

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Dr. Sassi V. Sassmannshausen Ph.D.
Cinema 4D Mentor since 2004
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Photography For C4D Artists: 200 Free Tutorials.
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Posted: 11 April 2021 09:59 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]  
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Wow that’s such a small hit area on a 4k monitor! It can’t be more than 2x2 pixels. There’s no way I’ve have realised that was an active area without you telling me. But now I know. THank you.

Ok. I started a new file with a cube and a landscape and everything behaves as it should. But this doesn’t help me. I understand all the theory and what should happen. I understand the projection vs the 3d paint. But understanding the theory was never the issue. The issue is what is it in my file that causing such problems because this is what I find so confusing and frustrating and the program offers no clue or help to enable me to understand. When all my UVs are unwrapped there’s a problem. When the UVs are straight out of the box there’s a problem.

I’ve attached the C4d file in the state exactly after my last screen capture.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/3for9iym5wnmdwy/gravymesh_0002.c4d.zip?dl=0

I really do massively appreciate all your help here. I’m sorry if I’m seeming really stupid and my questions are becoming annoying. I’m really trying my best to understand and put in the hard hours getting to the bottom of this before I progress

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Posted: 11 April 2021 11:11 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]  
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Following on from the basic primitive test I made a quick stylised dog and had no trouble painting it. While the position of the UVs meant I didn’t have complete control of what I was painting at no point did the brush refuse to paint the model. https://www.dropbox.com/s/mnjpelhac4tfel5/styliseddog.zip?dl=0

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Posted: 12 April 2021 03:00 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]  
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Hi charlesbatho,


Post #8
Here is the file back from post #8 with a screen capture. I opened the file and checked the UV. (The stripes were, as mentioned, the result of a flat/frontal projection. Which seems to be baked into the UV). I just packed it newly and then explored if I can fill, paint project paint on it. I saved the file in the state where it was left at the end of the recording.
Scene file, screen capture.
https://www.amazon.com/clouddrive/share/icxHBI6kdhPXF8cosfxxHoCJGVe0aURwKRjOIN7XDZ

Post #9
The cubic dog had not the best UV and hence the problems. Otherwise, I deleted the Symmetry Object (UVs can really use it if a dog-fur is the target).
Then I Main Menu> Mesh> Add> Subdivide>Cogwheel: Smooth Subdivision. With the very rough model, you get a smooth surface with the Subdivision Object, but the UV will not have a great quality.
I had a texture path error while opening it. Always have a “tex” folder in the Project folder; Cinema 4D will look there; otherwise, any texture in other places with the same name might be used.
File
https://www.amazon.com/clouddrive/share/n4Ual8G3TFAftIWF8uDzEenlhlCHc7FjMaFh9XAMmSD

Test files help to confirm what works and whatnot. When something works, we can exclude technical problems, like Graphic cards or anything else in the hardware or software. Error analytics via exclusion.

I understand your frustration. For over two decades, I help people, and I would say since 17 years, I mentor. For way over two decades, I learn, on average, one new application (or a new, more extensive update) per month. This keeps my feeling fresh when I hit the wall, let’s say in an audio application (where is that sound coming from? wink ), as some people do hit the wall with Cinema 4D here. It is good to keep that fresh; it feeds the patience: I KNOW THAT FRUSTRATION. Anyone who does not has never really worked hard and deep on something, end of the story. So, please never feel anything that you call “stupid”, it is not.

From my long-time experience, providing technical instructions is the smallest part of a trainer and the easiest. The central element is to understand the artist (even virtually) who sits in front of me. I think that differentiates the one given a few cool tricks away on the web, and on the other side trying to sort someone’s idea about a problem out.

Please always keep in mind, there is no mistake; there is only gained experience. You will see later on how much certainty you have gained going through all of that, as any problem you have experienced and solved will have minimal effect on you in the future. See yourself painting on that dog with fun soon; the rest will come.

Enjoy!

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Dr. Sassi V. Sassmannshausen Ph.D.
Cinema 4D Mentor since 2004
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Photography For C4D Artists: 200 Free Tutorials.
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Posted: 12 April 2021 02:36 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]  
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OK I think we’re making progress!

First off the stylised dog wasn’t posted as a problem… it was simply posted to show that even with a more complex mesh than a cube the painting still worked all the way across the mesh. I knew the UVs were sub optimal but that wasn’t the point. The point was to show that things worked in a different more real world project.

I watched your #08 capture many times, and did EXACTLY what you did with freshly packed UVs pausing to make sure every parameter matched exactly yours.

Once complete, while I could use the fill layer bucket the fill bucket still didn’t work consistently (like before) AND I still had the same problems where the brush just wouldn’t paint over certain areas of the model even if I rotated the model etc.

Scratched my head. Made a cup of tea and thought about your advice on reducing variables to try and debug the issue.

What I did was delete UV and material from the dog and then cut the dog model from my current project and pasted just the dog model into a brand new project.
Then added a UV tag with auto packing and created and saved a new material and applied it to the dog before opening the BP Paint layout.

Now, finally the paint brush works over the whole model. YAY!!! File here https://www.dropbox.com/s/6s3zme2nlvhjaos/gravymesh_0003.c4d.zip?dl=0

Do you have any idea as to what is blocking the app in the other file? It’s clearly something that’s cached or linked to the file from my machine because when you open my file on a fresh computer it works ok. I hope you can see now why I was tearing my hair out over this cos it made no sense. God it feels so good to have worked this out!

With this I will try and leave you in peace (for now hahaha!) so many thank yous for bearing with me and responding so quickly across Saturday and Sunday.

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Posted: 12 April 2021 02:54 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]  
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Thanks a lot, charlesbatho, for the update!

Sounds great! I have checked your file, and it works great here as well.

Please let me know if there is anything else. I’m happy to look into it.
If it is not related to the tutorials, please use the Q&A forum for anything.

Please contact Maxon about the renewal. I have no data on it, nor any option to get access to these. Sorry about this.
https://www.maxon.net/en/about-maxon/contact
Good luck!

Have a great day

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Dr. Sassi V. Sassmannshausen Ph.D.
Cinema 4D Mentor since 2004
Maxon Master Trainer, VES, DCS

Photography For C4D Artists: 200 Free Tutorials.
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Posted: 12 April 2021 02:58 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]  
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Yes thanks. I deleted the q about licence but you’d seen it before I deleted it!

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Posted: 12 April 2021 03:02 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]  
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My suggestion about Q&A was not related to your question about renewal. Sorry, that might have sounded not very friendly if it was received that way.
Thanks for your reply, so things are clear, charlesbatho!

I hope you can establish the renewal.

All the best

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Dr. Sassi V. Sassmannshausen Ph.D.
Cinema 4D Mentor since 2004
Maxon Master Trainer, VES, DCS

Photography For C4D Artists: 200 Free Tutorials.
https://www.youtube.com/user/DrSassiLA/playlists

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