A new version of Cineversity has been launched. This legacy site and its tutorials will remain accessible for a limited transition period

Visit the New Cineversity
   
 
Thinking Particles with bubble pop
Posted: 08 March 2017 05:51 PM   [ Ignore ]  
Total Posts:  36
Joined  2016-08-02

Dr. Sassi,

Since you have given me a lot to think about with weave I have come closer to what I am looking for! I decided to take a break from that for a couple of days and to learn more about thinking particles. I decided that a good way to learn was to have bubbles float up, hit a deflector and then burst into about 15 small particles like they have popped.

So far the scene is working, but I have a couple of questions. When my bubble hits the deflector it transfers to the new particle but it is still there and falls with gravity. How do I make it disappear when it hits the deflector?

Also is there a better way to time the new emitter that comes in when the old particle hits the deflector? The only way I can think right now is give it 5-6 seconds on animation. Which does not do it to all since all particles do not hit deflector by 6 seconds. Is there a way that when each individual particle hits the deflector that particle emits for about half a second?

Thanks for all advice in advance!

File Attachments
Thinking particles bubbles 1.zip  (File Size: 75KB - Downloads: 74)
Profile
 
 
Posted: 08 March 2017 06:39 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]  
Administrator
Avatar
Total Posts:  12043
Joined  2011-03-04

Hi Kotten_3,

Let me first point you to the XManager. This is the progress and information flow. Normally XPresso figures stuff out on its own, but if the process has a tie and does not know which one first, the XManger is used to decide. With larger set ups this is crucial to keep organized and in flow.

With this work done, my personal preference is to have on the left side in the editor what I already have or give, in the middle the “processing” and on the right the [sub] results.Which might end up being kind of “the given on the left below later on.
First things first and anything follows below, and here also the single nodes, what is above means I want to have it earlier processed. But the position is not read by XPresso, so the XManager needs to be fine.

All of that has helped me way over a decade to work in a clean way and understand files after a year …

===

The first thing that I would suggest is the Position and Event from the PDeflector to use to drive the PStorm, that eliminates quite some Nodes.

The Life-time of a specific Group (which you have set up very nicely, BTW) can be set to zero, which means it kills the particles. No timer needed anymore.

Note also that the Particle Geometry can hold subgroups, and you can have many of them, which allows you during your work to switch the PShapes results for that group “not generated”, as that is what the Particle Geometry does normally. It helps to have them named properly or place them on layers.

I hope I got your idea and your questions. There is always a possibility that I miss something, please ask if.

Scen file
https://www.amazon.com/clouddrive/share/YQrrYGDRjMUiLTPVuKguhx3ws1fNXJefD7o84A5rBLI?ref_=cd_ph_share_link_copy

All the best

 Signature 

Dr. Sassi V. Sassmannshausen Ph.D.
Cinema 4D Mentor since 2004
Maxon Master Trainer, VES, DCS

Photography For C4D Artists: 200 Free Tutorials.
https://www.youtube.com/user/DrSassiLA/playlists

NEW:

NEW: Cineversity [CV4]

Profile
 
 
Posted: 08 March 2017 06:49 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]  
Total Posts:  36
Joined  2016-08-02

Dr. Sassi,

That’s exactly what I am looking for! I didn’t know about the x-manager, I will now keep that all in mind!
So I was close just a couple of hiccups! Again I appreciate the help! smile

Profile
 
 
Posted: 08 March 2017 08:04 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]  
Administrator
Avatar
Total Posts:  12043
Joined  2011-03-04

Yes, very close, Kotten_3.

All of that has some complexity. But after a while it will be easier and easier. You might not notice it, as you certainly fight that impression of getting better with more complicated set ups, but that increased complexity is the indicator of your progress. grin

The XManager will help you to “think” about the information flow, and with this makes you look at the inner workings of your creation. IT might feel like an extra waste of time, but the support it has to your own work shouldn’t be ignored. I hope that makes sense.

Btw, perhaps explore the PFragment for this set up. (Hint, animate the threshold.)

Enjoy

 Signature 

Dr. Sassi V. Sassmannshausen Ph.D.
Cinema 4D Mentor since 2004
Maxon Master Trainer, VES, DCS

Photography For C4D Artists: 200 Free Tutorials.
https://www.youtube.com/user/DrSassiLA/playlists

NEW:

NEW: Cineversity [CV4]

Profile
 
 
Posted: 08 March 2017 08:27 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]  
Total Posts:  36
Joined  2016-08-02

I was thinking that the whole time working on this… something new and that was what I am going to learn next!

Profile
 
 
Posted: 08 March 2017 08:35 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]  
Administrator
Avatar
Total Posts:  12043
Joined  2011-03-04

Nice, and since you said it:

https://www.amazon.com/clouddrive/share/pwKtOPJYWnznSRuPIVbLlXlx0k4jDmlrSGkSTBkDITA?ref_=cd_ph_share_link_copy

ENJOY

 Signature 

Dr. Sassi V. Sassmannshausen Ph.D.
Cinema 4D Mentor since 2004
Maxon Master Trainer, VES, DCS

Photography For C4D Artists: 200 Free Tutorials.
https://www.youtube.com/user/DrSassiLA/playlists

NEW:

NEW: Cineversity [CV4]

Profile
 
 
Posted: 09 March 2017 07:28 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]  
Administrator
Avatar
Total Posts:  12043
Joined  2011-03-04

For your weekend exploration, please have a look how the XManager> XGroup will change the outcome, if not sorted nicely.

As a side effect, it shows the set up of the PFragment. The “…_edu…” file is in the clip. But there is also another file to showcase a possible set up.

Clip:
https://www.amazon.com/clouddrive/share/xXpTtGBYXiqae7AEvtVHlakYuucnp6j5eOPYTiG4WQT?ref_=cd_ph_share_link_copy

Scene file:
https://www.amazon.com/clouddrive/share/4UeV6mJiifb3vqQeNYFfxmwG37PcK9A183e7aINPesh?ref_=cd_ph_share_link_copy

All the best

 Signature 

Dr. Sassi V. Sassmannshausen Ph.D.
Cinema 4D Mentor since 2004
Maxon Master Trainer, VES, DCS

Photography For C4D Artists: 200 Free Tutorials.
https://www.youtube.com/user/DrSassiLA/playlists

NEW:

NEW: Cineversity [CV4]

Profile
 
 
Posted: 09 March 2017 07:48 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]  
Total Posts:  36
Joined  2016-08-02

wow that does make a big difference… I will break these down to learn everything I can from them! That is a really cool way of breaking down an object! I’m sure it can get crazy detailed too! smile

While I have you here I have been testing more with align to points with the particles. When the particles spawn on frame 1 it then stops spawning. So I have 6 particles that follow the nsides 6 points. Like the last time you helped me. While I am trying to learn particles more, after those hit the points on the spline I would then like to emit new particles once it attaches.

The problem I am having is that it is emitting from the start of the first emission and I can’t get it to start when it attaches.

Any ideas?

File Attachments
TP particle to particle emission.zip  (File Size: 62KB - Downloads: 73)
Profile
 
 
Posted: 09 March 2017 08:17 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]  
Administrator
Avatar
Total Posts:  12043
Joined  2011-03-04

Hi Kotten_3,

Thanks for the nicely organized XPresso Editor, so much more fun to explore your thoughts!

Here is you file back and I guess I leave it to you to explore it, instead of explaining things.
https://www.amazon.com/clouddrive/share/Zkf0FcTb2yMLjrJZhi74bjW6OGHIa8xlOrhCPA0snya?ref_=cd_ph_share_link_copy

However, if there is a question, just shoot.

ENJOY.

 Signature 

Dr. Sassi V. Sassmannshausen Ph.D.
Cinema 4D Mentor since 2004
Maxon Master Trainer, VES, DCS

Photography For C4D Artists: 200 Free Tutorials.
https://www.youtube.com/user/DrSassiLA/playlists

NEW:

NEW: Cineversity [CV4]

Profile
 
 
Posted: 09 March 2017 08:21 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]  
Total Posts:  36
Joined  2016-08-02

Thanks I am learning so much! And love it!:)

I knew it had to do with PGetData… Just didn’t even think about the distance node. Seeing this totally makes sense and I am going to push this one step further! I will show results when done

Profile
 
 
Posted: 09 March 2017 08:25 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]  
Administrator
Avatar
Total Posts:  12043
Joined  2011-03-04

Just information [-flow], what can be given/extracted, what can be processed, and what is wanted/needed.

What I found to be weird is that the distance can’t be zero. (Try it) No idea why, but a distance below 1 seems to work fine.

My best wishes for your exploration!

 Signature 

Dr. Sassi V. Sassmannshausen Ph.D.
Cinema 4D Mentor since 2004
Maxon Master Trainer, VES, DCS

Photography For C4D Artists: 200 Free Tutorials.
https://www.youtube.com/user/DrSassiLA/playlists

NEW:

NEW: Cineversity [CV4]

Profile
 
 
Posted: 09 March 2017 11:56 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]  
Total Posts:  36
Joined  2016-08-02

Okay I am learning from the fragment file, but in the meantime I am still learning about the following points particles. I took your example and tried to push it further. It starts and connects to the first points which then the particles shoot to another n-side that has been rotated, once it hits that it emits even more particles.

Problems I am having. There is a little delay once it connects to the first and starts to head toward the second n-side. I also cannot figure out how to only shoot out one particle per emitter. It is shooting out around 3. The last problem I am having is when I try to put a time effector to make the spline move on the y and z axis the points never make it to the spline and it basically stops right there. Kinda confused i guess.

File Attachments
TP particle to particle emission correct.zip  (File Size: 70KB - Downloads: 72)
Profile
 
 
Posted: 10 March 2017 03:16 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]  
Administrator
Avatar
Total Posts:  12043
Joined  2011-03-04

Hi Kotten_3,

Interesting behavior of the particles. Of course I had no idea that you need just one, and my initial though about that was, you have six, use them ;o)

As usual, when I can see the reason, I set up a new scene. Minimal configuration, to start with (file”…_22b”) \.

You have of course read about Rate, Shot and Count, and the very specific differences. If not, have a look:
https://help.maxon.net/#OP_STORM-ID_GVPORTS
This is crucial to know, if the use of the PStorm is important to you. 

The file was set up to provide six emitters at a certain point and at a certain time. If the Particle would reach at different times, I might change things. A reason why I like to know what is the idea from A-Z. ;o) But yes, I know, you explore.
A different challenge might result in a different set up.

As in replacing the initial six particles with six other particles that sit directly on the points and avoid so the follow calculation and its eventual imprecisions.

In the moment the six particles have reached the spline, I increased the speed for the PositionFollow. (A reason why the “distance” zero didn’t work, to the best of my knowledge—for now.)

I made also a little performance test, XPresso Editor Menu> Calculate > Performance View (Don’t leave it on, it takes only cpu power away ;o) However, it doesn’t show a bottle neck in the set up.

So, why the delay. back to my 22b set up, no delay. Reminder on the Count settings, as the max particles in the scene are calculated. That means the life time of such are in the mix and the amount. Somehow the scene doesn’t clean up, so the life time of 90 frames exceeds the scene time. It provides an impression as if the remaining time would be used before new particles are generated. You might notice that the scene 22 has nearly no delay now, but any change of the particles life time will change the delay again. The life time of 80 frames seems a good starting point.

Why not shot and switch it of after a Frame? That would normally work, but not in this set up with the Position Follow. Somehow there is some wiggle room in it based on the movement of the particles and their arrival point. Again, my best assumption after hunting the reason for a while.

I hope all of that helps a little bit to see the creative challenges one can have with a specific set up. Static Particles could always be used to set a position and a velocity-vector, with a certain life time, which is then a hand made Emitter. Store the Particles in a Group of no visibility and when prepared with new data—of they go in a new group.Something like that, to illustrate roughly the idea. You can even produce Particles in The MoGraph Matrix Object.

Perhaps let the PStorm produce and take the first six particles and ignore the rest; Just brainstorming

Scene file:
https://www.amazon.com/clouddrive/share/YTVwTb9LTLhKhn2QKbMwwYycOXStD3G8rCRBQ9oKNwp?ref_=cd_ph_share_link_copy

All the best

 Signature 

Dr. Sassi V. Sassmannshausen Ph.D.
Cinema 4D Mentor since 2004
Maxon Master Trainer, VES, DCS

Photography For C4D Artists: 200 Free Tutorials.
https://www.youtube.com/user/DrSassiLA/playlists

NEW:

NEW: Cineversity [CV4]

Profile
 
 
Posted: 10 March 2017 02:44 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]  
Total Posts:  36
Joined  2016-08-02

very helpful and way more complicated then I wanted to make it! Sorry for that. I will try some options out!

Profile
 
 
Posted: 10 March 2017 03:41 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]  
Administrator
Avatar
Total Posts:  12043
Joined  2011-03-04

You’re welcome, Kotten_3,

Perhaps have some Null Objects manually animated (the six initial) and set up a PStorm on each.

Simpler is often more work (which doesn’t mean slower!), while providing much more control in most cases.

Learning TP with a project is great, but if the project is solved in the best way with particles should be always questioned. :o)

Having said that, have a look here, similar result, different set up:

Scene file
https://www.amazon.com/clouddrive/share/bsqcdGgwC2WGALHcdrf4VbbihDXTD0olzehBdl7agpp?ref_=cd_ph_share_link_copy

Enjoy

 Signature 

Dr. Sassi V. Sassmannshausen Ph.D.
Cinema 4D Mentor since 2004
Maxon Master Trainer, VES, DCS

Photography For C4D Artists: 200 Free Tutorials.
https://www.youtube.com/user/DrSassiLA/playlists

NEW:

NEW: Cineversity [CV4]

Profile